Bible Questions

Yidda wrote:Does anyone have any questions about the Bible, either about the various languages, editions, manuscripts, authorship , or about specific difficult passages?

Please post your honest questions in this thread.

Jewel wrote:

Yes I do have some:

Based on my study about the bible, the first thing that came in to my mind is the authors of the different books of the bible, and what i found is that many writers of the different books of the bible both OT and NT are either uncertain or totally unknown.

Example: OT; The books of Numbers, Chronicles and Kings - Who wrote them really?

Example: NT; The book of Hebrews, who really wrote it?

There have been guesses, "may be's" - but there is no certainty.


Any positive comments there?

Thanks

Yidda wrote:


Hebrews is believed to have been written either by Paul, or by a disciple of Paul.

Some of the OT books were not written by one person, but by a number of authors and editors over a period of time. All of Sacred Scripture is the inspired writing of the Holy Spirit. Regardless of which persons or how many persons wrote any book of the Bible, God remains the One True Author of all. John wrote his Gospel, but some other persons completed it, all under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Paul wrote his letters, but with help from Tertius, Sosthenes, Timothy, Silvanus, and perhaps others. Yet each book of the Bible is entirely the work of the One God, Who is Author of all. It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.

Yidda wrote:It does not matter who the human authors were, since the One Supreme Author is God.

God is incapable of error of any kind on any subject. God Who is Truth cannot lie or speak a falsehood. For the Divine Nature of God is not merely truthful, as if truthfulness were a non-essential quality, but rather the Divine Nature is Truth.

Therefore, everything asserted bythe Holy Spirit, on any subject whatsoever, is certainly the truth. For He cannot deny Himself (2 Timothy 2:13). Since Dei Verbum teaches that“everything asserted by the inspired authors or sacred writers must be held to be asserted by the Holy Spirit,” there can be no error of any kind in Sacred Scripture, on any subject about which Sacred Scripture makes an assertion, and this doctrine must be believed.

Jewel wrote:

But how do you know that the author is God, is it because the bible says so?? That's clear circular reasoning dear sister yidda.

The point is the same, you have to accept the book of mormons and the vedas of the hindu as books from God too because they say so.

Jewel wrote:

The point is that since your bible does contain errors, it means that it is not from God because God is free from error while your bible is not - That's the bottom line there.

Jewel wrote:
That's blind following. The hindus has got the same beliefon their books too, so why dont you become a hindu and worship their idols?

No matter how many times and how strong is the claim that it is from God, butwe see errors in it, then it can NOT be from God because God cant make errors.

Since your bible is unauthentic and has many errors, therefore it is not God'sword no matter how strong is the claim....

Yidda wrote:Does anyone have any questions about the Bible, either about the various languages, editions, manuscripts, authorship , or about specific difficult passages?

Please post your honest questions in this thread.

Dhugz wrote:Sa Old testament ang nagsulat ng Bibliya ay mga Propeta na mga Hudyo, and the New Testament wrote by the Catholics in the first ce. Yes Holy ang Bibliya dahil Holy ang Church na nagcompiled at nagcnon nito at Holy din ang mga Propeta at mg katolikong nagsulat dito. Take note walang sinulat diyan ang mga protestante.

gin wrote:

Thanks sa response, Pareng Dhugz

Here's my follow up Qs:

How holy is the Bible?
How holy is the 'Church' who compiled the Bible?
Did God actually asked them to compile and canon the so called 'Holy Bible' that we use today? Site your credible and reliable source/s for reference, please.

Many thanks

MarcCatholic wrote:Kuya Jewel, diba sinasabi nyo pong maraming mali sa bibliya na kung saan kayo lang naman po ang nagsasabi niyan bilang muslim at palagay ko sa opinyon nyo yon, maganda siguro na magsimula ka ng thread kuya Jewel kung saan isa-isahin mo ang mga palagay mong pagkakamali ng bibliya. Salamat.

Dhugz wrote:Jewell, ang makakasagot talaga sa iyon tungkol diyan ay ang Church, the Church is proven na itinatag na ito noong unang siglo at pinatunayan ng mga miracles na totoo ang Iglesia Katolika na hindi naman natin nakikita sa ibang Relihiyon, sapat na sakin ang mga miracles na nangyari sa Iglesia upang paniwalaan ang kanyang kinanon na Bibliya, if the Church is in error sana hindi na nananahan ang Diyos dito, sana kinontra ng Diyos mismo na nagtatag sa Iglesia ang pagkacanon ng Bibliya.

Jewel wrote:

Thank you igan dhugz, i fully respect your very strong belief, trust, and reliance to the church - that's a very strong faith indeed.

However, if you are not a christian, and you are given that kind of response to the question, doesn't it sound that the response is definitely a circular argument if you weigh it objectively?

Moreover, if you put the integrity of the church at risk on the problem presented, wouldn't it show that the church is in fact unreliable because it cant show/answer where did they get those books.

Lastly, the same church had declared some books to be apocryphal (aside from what is also considered by protestants to be the 7 apocryphal books in the catholic bible) because of unknown authors/origin/spurious, YET we find many books of unknown authors with in the canonized bible -


Thanks

Dhugz wrote:

Napakataas ng integridad ng Iglesia Imagine the Bible is not just compiled and canonized in a single Council na naganap sa history of the Church, may series councils na siyang nag aral. pinagdebtehan ng husto ng mga Church Fathers, ang tanong ninyo na iyan ay naging katanungan din mismo sa mga councils of the Church. Lalo na noong Council of Trent na pinakamatagal na Council ang naganap sa history of the Church pero ano ang nangyari, lalo lamang napatatag ang Canon of Scripture na ginanap sa mga nagdaang Councila, diyan makikita na di lutong macau ang Bibliya unlike sa mga ibang tinuturing na sacred scriptures na hindi man lang binusisi ng maigi at ginawa at gawa gawa lang ng iilang tao o ng iisang tinuturing na mensahero o propeta. The Church ay mayroong Tradition which is the basis of the Canon of Scripture. Pag sinabi kasing Sacred Tradition ito yung minana pa ng Church mula noong unang siglo mula sa mga Unang Priests and Bishops na kung saan sila ang mga tinatawag na Apostol. Ang Tradition na ito ay written or in oral. Ako din naman di maniniwala sa Bibliya without the authority of the Church. Dahil sa Tradition na iyon, ay natrace ng Iglesia kung sino sino ang nagsulat ng mga aklat ng Bibliya at mga aklat na itinuturing na spurious at mga apocrypha, kaya kahit halimbawa kung ikaw ay nagsulat ng isang aklat na di mo inilagay ang pangalan mo pero may isa kang kaibigan na nakakilala sa iyo na ikaw ang nagsulat noon, eh di matutukoy pa din in the end kung sino ang author ng sinulat mo di ba? Ganyan ang nangyari sa Bibliya, yung mga aklat na hindi lantad kung sino ang author, ay mga statement ang mga Church Fathers noong unang siglo na mismong nakasama nila yung author, kaya inipon at itinago lahat ng Iglesia lahat ng mga Documents na pwedeng makilala ang pagkakakilanlan kung sino ang mga author ng mga aklat ng Bibliya na di lantarang hayag. My Friend inuulit ko, mas paniniwalaan ko ang aklat na pinagtibay, pinag aralan, pinagsunugan ng kilay ng hundred of years kesa sa aklat na isang araw, o isang buwan o isang taon lang ginawa ng iilan lamang, pwede kasing pure stsismis lahat yung nakasulat sa aklat na iyon di ba?

Jewel wrote:

I really appreciate your reliance to the church igan dhugz, amazing faith!


But still, that doesnt answer the main question, who wrote those books?

As you have mentioned, it has been a subject of discussion in the early church about the authorship of those books which i mentioned, and we dont really know how the debate was decided, but let's assume that the church successfully traced up the real authors - why cant they tell us who they are until now? moreover, it is not that they dont wanna tell us who the authors were, but they even boldly admitted that THEY DONT KNOW the authors of those books.

It implies that you believe the bible to be authentic just because you are told by the catholic church to do so, and not because the authors are certainly known; is that correct?


Thanks

Dhugz wrote:

Sinabi naman na nila eh, di ba? gaya nung Gospel according to St. Matthew at iba pa..... Tama ka sa huling statement mo, why should I believe in the Bible without believing the Church? Kahit wala pa ang Bibliya the Church is the Church, which is the Pillar and Ground for the Truth. Di naman ang Bibliya ang nagbasehan ni Cristo para itatag ang Church kundi ang Bibliya ay nabuo dahil sa Divine authority na ibinigay ng Diyos sa kanyang Iglesia.
Napakaganda Jewel at nagtatanong po kayo tungkol sa Church, though confused kayo sa Christianity because of many Protestants sects. Ok iyan, sana later on maiintindihan niyo ang stand of the Church at malay natin mas saradong katoliko ka pa sa amin. That's good sign mula sa iyo my Friend.

Jewel wrote:

Actually igan dhugz, kung hindi ako kombinsido sa Islam at Christianity lang ang option ko, sa Katoliko ako magpapasakop kasi kompara sa ibang sekta ng kristyanismo, ang katolik church ang may masasabi nating malapit na link sa mga sinaunang kristyanos, at ang mga ibang sekta ay nangopya at nanggamit lang sa mga output ng katolik church, walang originality.

anyway, balik sa paksa. Isa sa mga malalaking reasons, actually primary reason, kung bakit hindi ako kombesido sa Christian doctrines ay dahil sa authenticity ng scripture na kung saan binabase ang faith.

Sa Islam kasi kapag malabo ang source is considered weak at hindi pinagbabasihan. Hindi lang basta kilala ang author kundi dapat siguradong sya nga ang author talaga with a strong chain of reliable narrators.


Thanks

Dhugz wrote:

Sa amin scripture is just one of the basis of our faith, kaya nga di kami scripture alone di ba?
Ok with regards sa authenticity ng Bibliya, ang Church ang nakakaalam niyan, kaya nga pinagdebatehan di ba ng napakaraming taon almost 1000 years na pinagdedebatehan ang Bibliya, ibig sabihin nun lahat sana ng butas na makikita sa Bibliya eh wala na kasi sobrang naiprove na sa mundo that the Bible is authentic and free from errors, sa aming Catholic Faith the Church is infallible, pero ipinakita pa rin ng Church sa mundo na hindi moro moro yung pagkakacompile ng Bible bagkus ipinakita nito na tama at authentic ang Bible sa pamamagitan ng series councils, to examine the weakness side of the canonization of the bible, hindi tumigil ng iglesia sa iisang Canon bagkus sunod sunod pa iyan to make sure na free from error ito. Alam naman ng pangkalahatan na ang Church ay di basta basta nagdedeclare na authenctic ang isang bagay, halimbawa sa mga miracles, kahit gaano pa kagenuine ang isang apparitions o ng mga miracles sa Church, ang Church idinadaan lahat sa mga proseso para mapatunayan lamang na tama o genuine nga iyong miracles naa iyon, may scientific evidence at marami pang iba, kaya minsan inaabot ng 10 or 20 years minsan sa pagdedeklara ng mga ganyan eh, ksi masyadong strict ang Simbahan sa mga ganyan eh, ayaw nila ng moro morong pag aaral. Yung Priest nalang 11 years yan nag aral, imagine pati latin, greek at hebrew pinag aaralan din nila iyan, para lamang lalo nilang maintindihan ang unang aklat ng simbahan at mga original na salin ng Bibliya. Ganyan po, kaya siguradong sigurado kami sa Bibliya dahil ito ay di gawang tsismis lang, we have the Sacred Tradition na siyang batayan ng Simbahan sa pagkanon ng Bibliya. Yung unbroken line of succession nalang ng mga Priest mula sa mga apostol napakalaking batayan na iyon di ba? At alam naman natin na bawat document sa bawat siglo meron ang Iglesia kaya yan, imposibleng magkamali sila sa Bibliya, isa pa ang mga Kristiyano noon ay handang mamatay alang alang sa Iglesia, maraming katoliko ang pinatay ng mga pagano, madaming hinusgahan ng mga hudyo na mga Kristiyano, yung mga pari nga sa sa Latin Rite at Bishops sa Greek Catholic at sa Roman Rite eh walang asawa, ibig sabihin lamang po iyon talagang makikita natin na mga sincere ang mga taong ito para sa kapakanan ng Iglesia na tatag ng ating Panginoon. My friend siguro enough na iyan para mapatunayan lang na authentic ang Bibliya, may mga statement ang Simbahan tungkol diyan,kung gusto mo ng one by one na pagsasaliksik tungkol sa aming Bibliya, merong sagot diyan, masyado kasing mahaba pag isa isahin natin kung pano nalaman ng Iglesia ang mga author nang mga aklat ng Bibliya na di hayag dito. Try to use google or ask some of the Most intelligent Catholic Apologist, kasi karamihan sa kanila nag aral sa pagkapari .

Dhugz wrote:Jewel baka dito malinawan ka. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11646c.htm