Is God present in hell as He is in heaven?

fredms3 wrote:What's your position on this brothers and sisters...

what is your position in this issue fred? What does your church teaches about it, or is there any church teaching about it at all?

Jewel wrote:

what is your position in this issue fred? What does your church teaches about it, or is there any church teaching about it at all?

He is present in hell but not as He is in heaven. Meron kasi akong nakuhang sagot confirming the thread topic.

How about your position there Jewel?

fredms3 wrote:

He is present in hell but not as He is in heaven. Meron kasi akong nakuhang sagot confirming the thread topic.

How about your position there Jewel?

The Islamic position in this question is that God is not present in hell because hell cant contain God because God is the Greatest of all and He is above all the creation.


I was asking you whether your church has an answer to your question or not....

He is present in hell but not as He is in heaven

Is that the catholic position in this question, or it is just your personal opinion? I just want to clarify this very important matter because I didnt find any answer in the bible. I understand that the Catholicism has extra biblical sources which I haven't read them yet.

This is a good topic BTW.


Thanks

fredms3 wrote:

He is present in hell but not as He is in heaven. Meron kasi akong nakuhang sagot confirming the thread topic.

Paano nyo po mapaaptunayan?
Verse pls.

well it's kinda simple for a simple-minded bloke such as meh.. if god can go anywhere then can he go to hell? j3j3j3 @_@

i wish it should j3j3j3 ^_^

He must be...who's lookin out to those who wanted to escape...

miss_terry wrote:

Paano nyo po mapaaptunayan?
Verse pls.

God is love. Imposible na magkaroon ng love dyan sa hell. Ano say mo sis?

God is love. Imposible na magkaroon ng love dyan sa hell. Ano say mo sis?

aint gawd omnipresent? innit contradicting?

sakundes wrote:

aint gawd omnipresent? innit contradicting?

Pwedeng pakiayos ang post mo bro Sak. This is my second request to you regarding the way you post.

That's right, God is Omnipresent. His power (for me) is present in hell, but to be there as he is in heaven where Love, Peace and total happiness reign is impossible indeed.

Jewel wrote:

The Islamic position in this question is that God is not present in hell because hell cant contain God because God is the Greatest of all and He is above all the creation.


I was asking you whether your church has an answer to your question or not....



Is that the catholic position in this question, or it is just your personal opinion? I just want to clarify this very important matter because I didnt find any answer in the bible. I understand that the Catholicism has extra biblical sources which I haven't read them yet.

This is a good topic BTW.


Thanks

I still don't read the official teaching of RCC regarding the kind of presence God is in hell. The church teaches that God is Omnipresent but i doubt RCC would say that God is in hell the way He is in heaven. I am researching on that actually.

That's correct we cannot find directly the answer in the Bible, however, that can not stop us from giving our own view the way theologians do.

Thanks for sharing your input the way Islam puts it.

fredms3 wrote:What's your position on this brothers and sisters...

YEs GOD IS omnipotent, omniscient, omniscience

fredms3 wrote:
I still don't read the official teaching of RCC regarding the kind of presence God is in hell. The church teaches that God is Omnipresent but i doubt RCC would say that God is in hell the way He is in heaven. I am researching on that actually.

That's correct we cannot find directly the answer in the Bible, however, that can not stop us from giving our own view the way theologians do.

Thanks for sharing your input the way Islam puts it.

So what you have now is a vague concept of God; very risky to idolatry.

I dont agree with your idea that God is omnipresent because to say so, it would mean that he could be inside satan's stomach, or he could be in filthy places.

I believe that the Islamic concept is logical, that God is not omnipresent but he is omniscient or all knowing (absolute/infinite knowledge of everything).

Didnt Jesus say in your NT "Oh father, thou art in heaven"? Why make guesses?

Jewel wrote:

So what you have now is a vague concept of God; very risky to idolatry.

I dont agree with your idea that God is omnipresent because to say so, it would mean that he could be inside satan's stomach, or he could be in filthy places.

I believe that the Islamic concept is logical, that God is not omnipresent but he is omniscient or all knowing (absolute/infinite knowledge of everything).

Didnt Jesus say in your NT "Oh father, thou art in heaven"? Why make guesses?

Is the Bible your basis in saying that God is not Omnipresent?

fredms3 wrote:

Is the Bible your basis in saying that God is not Omnipresent?

No, my basis is the Quran; I just read that some passages in your bible do support the Quran on this issue.

This is my question to you if you dont mind, How big God is, or Who is bigger God or the entire/whole creation?

Thanks

Ang pagkaalam ko sa mga bagay bagay na iyan ay hindi omnipresent si God... ngunit kahit anung lugar ay pwede niya puntahan.

Jewel wrote:

No, my basis is the Quran; I just read that some passages in your bible do support the Quran on this issue.

This is my question to you if you dont mind, How big God is, or Who is bigger God or the entire/whole creation?

Thanks

Please provide the verse Jewel. Let's just focus first on the issue of God's Omnipresent, thanks.

element_115x wrote:Ang pagkaalam ko sa mga bagay bagay na iyan ay hindi omnipresent si God... ngunit kahit anung lugar ay pwede niya puntahan.

Lalabas nyan brother na alang pinag-iba si God sa atin. Kahit saan pwede nating puntahan. Ano sa tingin mo?

fredms3 wrote:Please provide the verse Jewel. Let's just focus first on the issue of God's Omnipresent, thanks.

Sure:

Matthew 6:9–13

⁹After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. ¹⁰Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. ¹¹Give us this day our daily bread. ¹²And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. ¹³And
lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the
kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen

It says that God is in heaven not on earth so how is he omnipresent?

Well, may be Jesus was on earth because you consider him to be god too; but he was in jerusalem, what about there in philippines? So how is it omnipresent?



BTW you didnt answer my question to you:

This is my question to you if you dont mind, How big is God , or Who is bigger God or the entire/whole creation?

Thanks

Thanks

Jewel wrote:

Sure:

Matthew 6:9–13

⁹After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. ¹⁰Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven. ¹¹Give us this day our daily bread. ¹²And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors. ¹³And
lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the
kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen

It says that God is in heaven not on earth so how is he omnipresent?

Well, may be Jesus was on earth because you consider him to be god too; but he was in jerusalem, what about there in philippines? So how is it omnipresent?



BTW you didnt answer my question to you:



Thanks

I'l get back to the topic pagdating ko sa bahay. Time to go home na.

fredms3 wrote:

I'l get back to the topic pagdating ko sa bahay. Time to go home na.

sure, take your time

Jewel wrote:

So what you have now is a vague concept of God; very risky to idolatry.

I dont agree with your idea that God is omnipresent because to say so, it would mean that he could be inside satan's stomach, or he could be in filthy places.

I believe that the Islamic concept is logical, that God is not omnipresent but he is omniscient or all knowing (absolute/infinite knowledge of everything).

Didnt Jesus say in your NT "Oh father, thou art in heaven"? Why make guesses?

Let me post this:

Psalm 139 (NIV)

For the director of music. Of David. A psalm.

¹ O LORD, you have searched me
and you know me.
² You know when I sit and when I rise;
you perceive my thoughts from afar.
³ You discern my going out and my lying down;
you are familiar with all my ways.
⁴ Before a word is on my tongue
you know it completely, O LORD.
⁵ You hem me in—behind and before;
you have laid your hand upon me.
⁶ Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too lofty for me to attain.
⁷ Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
⁸ If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, ^[a] you are there.
⁹ If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,
¹⁰ even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.
¹¹ If I say, "Surely the darkness will hide me
and the light become night around me,"
¹² even the darkness will not be dark to you;
the night will shine like the day,
for darkness is as light to you.
¹³ For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother's womb.
¹⁴ I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
¹⁵ My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,
¹⁶ your eyes saw my unformed body.
All the days ordained for me
were written in your book
before one of them came to be.
¹⁷ How precious to ^[b] me are your thoughts, O God!
How vast is the sum of them!
¹⁸ Were I to count them,
they would outnumber the grains of sand.
When I awake,
I am still with you.
¹⁹ If only you would slay the wicked, O God!
Away from me, you bloodthirsty men!
²⁰ They speak of you with evil intent;
your adversaries misuse your name.
²¹ Do I not hate those who hate you, O LORD,
and abhor those who rise up against you?
²² I have nothing but hatred for them;
I count them my enemies.
²³ Search me, O God, and know my heart;
test me and know my anxious thoughts.
²⁴ See if there is any offensive way in me,
and lead me in the way everlasting.

fredms3 wrote:
Let me post this:

Psalm 139 (NIV)

For the director of music. Of David. A psalm.

¹ O LORD, you have searched me
and you know me.
² You know when I sit and when I rise;
you perceive my thoughts from afar.
³ You discern my going out and my lying down;
you are familiar with all my ways.
⁴ Before a word is on my tongue
you know it completely, O LORD.
⁵ You hem me in—behind and before;
you have laid your hand upon me.
⁶ Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too lofty for me to attain.
⁷ Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
⁸ If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, ^[a] you are there.
⁹ If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,
¹⁰ even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.
¹¹ If I say, "Surely the darkness will hide me
and the light become night around me,"
¹² even the darkness will not be dark to you;
the night will shine like the day,
for darkness is as light to you.
¹³ For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother's womb.
¹⁴ I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.
¹⁵ My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,
¹⁶ your eyes saw my unformed body.
All the days ordained for me
were written in your book
before one of them came to be.
¹⁷ How precious to ^[b] me are your thoughts, O God!
How vast is the sum of them!
¹⁸ Were I to count them,
they would outnumber the grains of sand.
When I awake,
I am still with you.
¹⁹ If only you would slay the wicked, O God!
Away from me, you bloodthirsty men!
²⁰ They speak of you with evil intent;
your adversaries misuse your name.
²¹ Do I not hate those who hate you, O LORD,
and abhor those who rise up against you?
²² I have nothing but hatred for them;
I count them my enemies.
²³ Search me, O God, and know my heart;
test me and know my anxious thoughts.
²⁴ See if there is any offensive way in me,
and lead me in the way everlasting.

I think, you missed to highlight this part :

¹ O LORD, you have searched me
and you know me.
² You know when I sit and when I rise;
you perceive my thoughts from afar.
³ You discern my going out and my lying down;
you are familiar with all my ways.
⁴ Before a word is on my tongue
you know it completely, O LORD.
⁵ You hem me in—behind and before;
you have laid your hand upon me.
⁶ Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too lofty for me to attain.
⁷ Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
⁸ If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, ^[a] you are there.
⁹ If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,
¹⁰ even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.

So I think that it is not talking about omnipresence, BUT omniscience because the context clearly emphasizes the knowledge of God.

In fact, the last 2 verses of it concludes the matter, that it means knowledge of God

²³ Search me, O God, and know my heart;
test me and know my anxious thoughts.
²⁴ See if there is any offensive way in me,
and lead me in the way everlasting.


In other words, the passages which you quoted belie the belief that God is omnipresent. It supports the belief that God is omniscience.


Moreover, the question is still unanswered: Is God present in Satan's stomach?

Jewel wrote:

I think, you missed to highlight this part :

¹ O LORD, you have searched me
and you know me.
² You know when I sit and when I rise;
you perceive my thoughts from afar.
³ You discern my going out and my lying down;
you are familiar with all my ways.
⁴ Before a word is on my tongue
you know it completely, O LORD.
⁵ You hem me in—behind and before;
you have laid your hand upon me.
⁶ Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
too lofty for me to attain.
⁷ Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
⁸ If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, ^[a] you are there.
⁹ If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,
¹⁰ even there your hand will guide me,
your right hand will hold me fast.

So I think that it is not talking about omnipresence, BUT omniscience because the context clearly emphasizes the knowledge of God.

In fact, the last 2 verses of it concludes the matter, that it means knowledge of God

²³ Search me, O God, and know my heart;
test me and know my anxious thoughts.
²⁴ See if there is any offensive way in me,
and lead me in the way everlasting.


In other words, the passages which you quoted belie the belief that God is omnipresent. It supports the belief that God is omniscience.


Moreover, the question is still unanswered: Is God present in Satan's stomach?

It does not belie Omnipresence, on the contrary it proves the two --- Omnipresence and Omniscience.

"Where can i flee from your presence?" ---- the following lines answer that question.